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110%er [6983]
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After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 9:19 AM
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What is an acceptable season for Clemson now? I recall during the Bowden years many folks were happy with eight wins, I was not one of them, but this group of fans would parrot off “hey he graduates his players and runs a clean program, 8 wins is fine with me as long as he beats South Carolina.
After Dabo took over, I recall Being thrilled over winning the Atlantic division for the first time, and finishing with 9 wins. Then the bar got raised in 2011 and we won 10 games for the first time in 20 years, and won the ACC, …finally. Double digit wins became the new normal, and then of course the historic run between 2015 and 2020, where 12+ wins became routine. The fact of the matter is, expecting to win 13 games every season is not realistic. Injuries happen, players sometimes don’t work out or transfer out, coaches leave, sometimes hires don’t work out, and sometimes on the road you just get beat. I think a reasonable expectation for Clemson football, is to win all of your out of conference games most years, and win six or seven ACC games, most years. This is 9-10 regular season wins, and perhaps expect at least one postseason win each year. Total of 10 or 11 wins. Expecting a yearly total above this I feel like it’s just setting yourself up for disappointment and putting unrealistic expectations on the football program. If the program gets hot and goes 14-1 and wins the national championship, we’ll just enjoy it, cause that’s really, really, really hard to do. You kinda have to be lucky as well. Alabama knows all about that…
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Orange Blooded [3615]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 9:23 AM
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An acceptable season varies on the year. If we sign the #1 class in the nation, but they are all true frosh, then you expect growing pains. Every year isn't the same. It depends what we are working with.
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110%er [5571]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 9:27 AM
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As I was reading through posts the past couple of days, I was wondering the same thing. The question I would ask is what if we go 10-2 in the regular season next year, beat the coots, lose a second game to FSU or whoever we play in ACC CG, and then win the Cheez It or Gator Bowl to finish 11-3 again?
Message was edited by: raider12®
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CU Guru [1865]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 9:32 AM
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Ask yourself, would Bama/UGA/Ohio St be content with that scenario? I think we all know the answer.
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Legend [15545]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 9:43 AM
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I'm sure they're not content, but each of them have been there, and each will be there again.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 11:01 AM
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Duga
I agree that even the elite can have a dry spell, but my worry (& I think the worry in the back of many people's minds here) is if we will, given Dabo's insular approach, ever rise back to the level of elite like these afore-mentioned programs have.
If we do well in the CFP in the coming years, then we will look back on this as a dry spell. But if the downward trend continues we will become a top 25 program and a contestant in the ever less relevant bowl games.
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Hall of Famer [23003]
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IKR we didn't have 10 wins or a conference championship
Jan 2, 2023, 9:30 AM
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for 30 years and now it's not enough to have 12 ten win seasons in a row and 8 conference championships in that time. Perspective is important. Like you said, 13 wins every season is not realistic, but even if we did, would that be enough for some?
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Scout Team [191]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 9:31 AM
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It’s sad that so many people live off their feelings and emotions. If that’s all a person has then for them Clemson better never lose. They can’t handle it but they are the Sam people who can’t handle anything that doesn’t go their way. Let a car pull out in front of them and contempt will come out of their mouth because it’s what is in their heart. Whatever is on the inside will come out and they can’t catch it before it comes out.
You are right! We should really enjoy the special seasons. They are hard to come by and with Dabo as our leader, there will be more. As long as Dabo is here we will always be able to compete for an ACC CHAMPIONSHIP and now that they are going to 12 team playoff in 2024, we will have a shot at that every year.
I’m looking forward to next season already! Go Tigers!
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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back to back 3 loss seasons is unacceptable considering.....
Jan 2, 2023, 9:31 AM
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our Head coach is the 2nd highest salaried coach in the country
AND
we play in the ACC
2-5 in OOC P5 games the last 3 years is UNACCEPTABLE considering the ABOVE...........sorry, it just is..........Especially if we have the "TALENT" some on here are claiming we have.
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110%er [5571]
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Re: back to back 3 loss seasons is unacceptable considering.....
Jan 2, 2023, 9:57 AM
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Pheebo. I hear u on the salary plus other resources the university has devoted to football, but is Dabo being paid for what he is doing now or rewarded for what he did on the past? I would argue the latter. Doesn’t mean it’s right but I believe that’s the case. On the other hand, you can’t ask the university to devote top 5 money/resources to football and not finish in the top 5 every few years. That’s where things could get ugly if Dabo goes 2 more years without at least a top 10 final ranking.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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Re: back to back 3 loss seasons is unacceptable considering.....
Jan 2, 2023, 10:13 AM
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I get that. Dabo is being paid for past success but also to sustain it. There are fundamental flaws in the way Dabo is navigating the new world of college football. It’s seen in the trend line of our program since our peak of 2018. It’s also not a coincidence it started slipping around the NIL/portal trend. No, that’s not the only reason for our slip. Dabos hires and misguided optimism that every “underdog” both coach and player that he touches will magically turn into a Hunter Renfrow if also aiding the downturn.
Why a lot on here can’t see that is beyond me.
+1 for your rational response btw.
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Legend [18349]
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Re: back to back 3 loss seasons is unacceptable considering.....
Jan 2, 2023, 11:26 AM
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Legit question how many games are we only allowed to lose one game a year or do we have to go undefeated every year for it to be acceptable for you?
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Team Captain [475]
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I don’t care if we go 11-1 every season, if that loss
Jan 2, 2023, 9:36 AM
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is to the coots, the season has a smelly smudge on it.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 10:56 AM
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dixon,
If you just look at the numbers, I am not dissatisfied.
But if you consider whether we played up to our potential, well that's a different story.
And the fact that most of it was self-inflicted . . .
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Head Coach [785]
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Re: After all this hand wringing and gnashing of teeth, it begs the question
Jan 2, 2023, 11:23 AM
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I’m with you on this Tobias. It’s not purely about the record for me. And it’s not CFP or bust, for me personally. With our schedule, we should be able to achieve both a level of play and a record that gets us in the conversation for CFP. Had we beaten our in-state rival, we would’ve been in the conversation this year. And that’s absolutely a game we should have won this year, and didn’t win because of numerous mistakes and stupid moves by the coaches. I cannot be content with that. Losing at ND always seemed like a possibility to me. But losing the way we did at ND, unacceptable.
Over the past decade, one of my indicators has been are we consistently competitive in and sometimes winning big games. 2019 CFP was a perfect example of that- won a close one vs OSU, lost to an all time great LSU team in the title game. Unfort now, we’re losing more big games than we’re winning now. And it’s for a variety of reasons, talent, physicality, gameplan - these are simply not as good as they used to be when we play legit opponents. I hope that changes next season. I do think our game w/ FSU next season (possibly games w/ ACCCG) could return to true big game status for us. I’ll be curious to see how we fare in next year’s big games.
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