|
Replies: 17
| visibility 201
|
Orange Blooded [2111]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 1908
Joined: 1/7/00
|
Who here wants to help Ukraine? Who wants to help Israel?....
Apr 14, 2024, 6:58 PM
|
|
I think we need to step up and help Ukraine will more aid. It's easily affordable, and they are doing the fighting, not our own soldiers. It's a no-brainer, because it will put a huge dent in Russia's designs on Eastern Europe. If Russia is allowed to over-run Ukraine, which will likely eventually happen if we pull the rug out from under Ukraine, it will not be the last country they invade. Defeat them now in Ukraine, or we'll likely be fighting them in the future in a hot war with American troops.
Israel is our ally in the Middle East, and we will have to support them against Iran, because if Israel collapses, we're likely in complete chaos in a region of the world where chaos already rules, and would go over the top without a functioning Israel.
Both of the above are important, because China is watching. If they see a weak US response in Israel and Ukraine, it will embolden them in Taiwan. And we don't want that, because Taiwan will not be the last of China's demands.
|
|
|
|
 |
Orange Blooded [3728]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6092
Joined: 10/20/00
|
Not sure about Israel
1
Apr 14, 2024, 7:33 PM
|
|
They have $$ and weapons already. We could potentially launch some missles, but that's about it
I am fully in favor of helping Ukraine's ground troops. I am thoroughly against having Ukraine' corrupt oligarchs skim 20% off the top. Not sure we've figured out yet how to accomplish this
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [17327]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 14275
Joined: 12/14/98
|
Both issues are complex. It is legit that US assistance comes with contingencies***
Apr 14, 2024, 7:40 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3728]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6092
Joined: 10/20/00
|
Smitty you're really wrong
Apr 14, 2024, 7:48 PM
|
|
When you say "it's easily affordable". It's not, we are running massive deficits
That is not to say whether we should or should not do it
Not having money for something has never stopped Congress before
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2111]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 1908
Joined: 1/7/00
|
It's miniscule on our budget....
Apr 14, 2024, 8:02 PM
|
|
https://cepr.net/putting-ukraine-spending-in-context/
It's about 0.2% of GDP and about 0.8% of our federal budget.
I don't discount budget deficits as a reason to think twice, and maybe there should be some cuts in other parts of the government. But this isn't much on our budget, and our deficits have been coming down alot since the pandemic surge in deficits.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FYFSGDA188S
I think we can afford it easily.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3728]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6092
Joined: 10/20/00
|
.8% of our budget
Apr 14, 2024, 8:05 PM
|
|
What percentage of the amount of taxes that we take in?
What percentage of our spending goes to interest on debt?
By what percent are we spending more than we take in?
I think looking at it as a percent of our overall budget is the wrong way to about things. I don't know the answers to the above questions BTW, and I'm also not saying whether or not we should do it
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2111]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 1908
Joined: 1/7/00
|
Look, I don't think looking at it on a budget standpoint is wrong....
1
Apr 14, 2024, 8:13 PM
|
|
But we're not in any sort of debt panic trouble here. As a country that issues our own currency and with our own central bank, we have the ability to borrow an enormous amount of money with no trouble.
The interest on our debt is rising as a % of gdp, but still in a very manageable range, and has been much higher at other points in our nation's history without causing even a ripple.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FYOIGDA188S
So, I really don't see why budget concerns should be an issue with the assistance to Ukraine.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [11045]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 8013
Joined: 10/18/16
|
Re: Look, I don't think looking at it on a budget standpoint is wrong....
Apr 14, 2024, 8:51 PM
|
|
You don't think that there is no limit to adding to the deficit? When is a good time to stop the bleeding? At the current rate of spending, the deficit will be 200% of the GDP in 25 years. It has been calculated we have until 2028 to turn it around or the additional debt to GDP will grow exponentially. Who do you think will pay for it, us, our children, our grandchildren, or all the above? At some point, there is default and it all comes crumbling down. After that, who has the money to pau our debts owns us. Even now the "big central bank", the Feral Reserve, is losing money but I've read that doesn't count because it just means no free discretionary money for the Treasury to spend. SMH
https://www.gao.gov/americas-fiscal-future#:~:text=Unless%20current%20revenue%20and%20spending,percent%20of%20GDP%20by%202050.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2111]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 1908
Joined: 1/7/00
|
Three things:
Apr 14, 2024, 9:05 PM
|
|
1) It's a fake crisis: People have been screaming about debt for decades. But we have a strong ability to absorb debt. Japan has debt/gdp of over 200%, and they're actually doing quite well as a nation. There isn't going to be a crash or a run on the bank with our debt. There won't be a default. I don't say, BTW, that there's no limit whatsoever. But I think we have much much further to go before it's an actual problem.
2) Deficit Peacocks: Alot of the people who are screaming about the debt are unwilling to raise taxes, which means they're not serious about addressing debt. Their actions speak louder than their words. THe GOP in particular have been faux deficit/debt peacocks. When they're out of power, they scream about it all day. When they're in power, they sign on for budget busting wars, spending, and tax cuts.
3) 2028: There's nothing special about 2028. So, if we go over 106% of gdp, it means nothing. We've been there before, and we grew out of it.
So in summary, calm down.
Now, if you want to actually cut deficits, I'm fine with it. But it's going to take tax increases and spending cuts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [11045]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 8013
Joined: 10/18/16
|
Re: Three things:
Apr 15, 2024, 12:58 AM
|
|
So you live that way in your personal life? Good for you if you can do it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [13179]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 14204
Joined: 11/2/15
|
Please post pictures of the checks you wrote to Ukraine.***
1
Apr 14, 2024, 7:58 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2111]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 1908
Joined: 1/7/00
|
I'm a taxpayer, so money I've sent the govt has funded Ukraine.****
Apr 14, 2024, 8:02 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [13179]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 14204
Joined: 11/2/15
|
The IRS will take more, write dem checks!!!***
Apr 14, 2024, 8:06 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [34649]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 41453
Joined: 4/20/01
|
^^^POTD^^^***
Apr 14, 2024, 8:17 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [12605]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6321
Joined: 12/24/15
|
Re: Who here wants to help Ukraine? Who wants to help Israel?....
Apr 14, 2024, 9:01 PM
|
|
Both but with conditions. Putin and Iran will become emboldened if we stop backing Ukraine and Israel respectively.
However, NATO needs to pay far more towards Ukraine. This conflict is in their backyard.
The sanctions need to be tightened on Iran not loosened as Biden did. Totally dumb and weak move.
Our credibility is already hurt by the manner in which the Afghan withdrawal took place.
Got to stay the course.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Team Captain [497]
TigerPulse: 94%
Posts: 750
Joined: 10/11/12
|
Re: Who here wants to help Ukraine? Who wants to help Israel?....
Apr 14, 2024, 10:01 PM
|
|
Definitely help Ukraine and quickly
Probably help Israel … but I am open to discussion on that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10929]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 15101
Joined: 8/6/10
|
Not me. End all foreign aid. Bring the troops home.***
1
Apr 14, 2024, 10:25 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [7228]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 9465
Joined: 12/18/13
|
Help Ukraine, cut Israel off
Apr 14, 2024, 11:39 PM
|
|
Until they oust BiBi and his coalition of lunatics.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 17
| visibility 201
|
|
|
50
