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Orange Blooded [2111]
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J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 30, 2024, 10:35 AM
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It started prior to the 2020 election, when Trump started signaling that he would not accept an outcome where he didn't win. He started badmouthing mail-in-voting, even though it had been in place for decades in certain states already (including red ones), and was being used to help people vote who didn't want to be in a crowd during a pandemic.
Then, there was the bogus declaration of victory on the evening of the election, while votes were still being counted, as some states weren't even allowed to count mail-in ballots until the day of the election.
Then, there were the dozens of fact-free lawsuits filed on behalf of Trump by his brigade of idiot lawyers. Most of them were laughed out of court, even by Republican judges.
Then, there was pressure put on the DOJ to find non-existent fraud, or certainly nowhere near enough.
Then, there was pressure put on local and state politicians to not certify results, or to order needless re-counts.
Then, there were the states (the swing states) that went for Biden that had fake electors voting on behalf of Trump.
Then, there was the pressure put on Mike Pence to not certify the actual real electors on 1/6 in front of Congress.
Then, there were tweets, directing Trump's idiot Red Hat mob to come to the capital. "Be there. Will be wild."
Then, there was the rally. Kicked off by a Trump rally, where he directed his idiots to go down to the capital and fight like Hell.
Then, there was the riot, where police officers were attacked, where the capital was breached, where people died, and where crowds were chanting "Hang Mike Pence", and looking for Nancy Pelosi, too. There were paramilitary groups lined up to help facilitate the mob. Congress had to flee the premises for their own safety. And while this was going on, Trump did nothing. He wanted all of this. These were his people, and he wanted them to commit violence.
Trump is a fascist, folks. That's what he is. And if you support him today, you're supporting fascism.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 30, 2024, 10:41 AM
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It was Antifa and the FBI. Get your story straight.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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LOL. I forgot about them.****
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Mar 30, 2024, 10:47 AM
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Orange Blooded [4021]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 30, 2024, 10:58 AM
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Trump had nothing to do with it. Those animals all showed up happenstance.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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Barton Gellman laid it all out prior to the election...
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Mar 30, 2024, 11:56 AM
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https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/11/what-if-trump-refuses-concede/616424/
He had been speaking to GOP operatives and Red-Hatters, and he pretty much was exactly correct in what he predicted would happen.
The goal, once Trump knew he'd lost (and he knew he'd legitimately lost) was to find a way to kick the election beyond 1/6, and have it settled in the House of Representatives, where the Republicans had a state count advantage. This was the goal of Trump and his Red-Hat inner-circle.
They first tried to do it through the courts, and by pressuring states to not certify. The actual Electoral College in December should have settled everything. But, after that occurred, the focus shifted immediately to 1/6. They had to somehow stop that proceeding, and that's when the pressure on Mike Pence was ratcheted up.
The only reason the conspiracy didn't work is that at crucial times, certain GOP members didn't break under the pressure. Guys like Raffensperger in Georgia, and Pence, and Aaron Van LangeVelde in Michigan....they just did their job and wouldn't be co-opted by the conspiracy.
And I've never thought of the overall conspiracy as an "Insurrection". I've thought of it as a Coup. The goal of the Coup was to overturn the election by any means necessary.
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Hall of Famer [24217]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 30, 2024, 11:12 AM
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Now, I thought it started when the left claimed Trump's Presidency was illegitimate because the Russians put him in power and began to use impeachment as a political tool.
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Hall of Famer [24217]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 30, 2024, 11:16 AM
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Either way, if the best a party can do for a Presidential nominee is Bozo and the Dead Guy, then it's time to stop taking those parties seriously and move on to something else.
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CU Medallion [58489]
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^This is the takeaway.***
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Mar 30, 2024, 11:53 AM
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 30, 2024, 12:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy... ] |
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I agree with you completely, but I will definitely take the dead guy over the deranged lunatic fraud. I would have take Nikki Haley over both of them though. Picking our poison now. In good conscience I could never vote for Trump.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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I voted for Nikki in the primaries....
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Mar 30, 2024, 12:24 PM
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And since she lost, I'll have to vote for Biden again.
I don't consider him a "dead guy." He's a good president, who inherited a broken country in a pandemic. But he is old. Nikki would have been a return to normalcy, IMO. But the Red Hats don't want normalcy. They want to break the country.
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CU Guru [1388]
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Re: I voted for Nikki in the primaries....
Apr 1, 2024, 8:52 AM
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You voted for Nikki in the primary bc you hate Trump. Even if she won you would still vote for Biden bc you are a democrat. Stop with the bs man.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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Hall of Famer [24217]
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Re: You thought wrong****
Mar 30, 2024, 1:23 PM
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No, I thought right
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CU Medallion [58489]
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Trump legitimately lost the elction.
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Mar 30, 2024, 12:31 PM
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Trump and many of his followers could not accept this reality.
Some of those followers were insane enough to turn violent and force their way into the capitol. Probably thinking they could affect history by altering an election.
Trump tried just about everything he could, short of a military coup, to prevent the legitimate transfer of power to Joe Biden.
Trump did not plan, organize, or instruct anyone to violently force their way into the capitol. "Fight like hell" and "Be there. It will be wild." is not any such instruction. Period. I think he gloated and reveleled in it for a time while it was happening, however.
Many of the people who entered the capitol that day did so freely, without participating in any violence, and were in there out of curiosity once they saw people entering and exiting freely. They were not in any way part of an attempted coup.
It was an ugly, tragic day for America, and it was driven by a narcissist a-hole who could not accept defeat. This is in no way a partisan defense or criticism of anything; that's just what happened. Were a whole lot of Trump supporters involved in illegal activity that day? Of course they were; they were crazy, and they broke the law. Was anything Trump did illegal? It's very likely, but courts will ultimately determine that.
Everything else is partisan political noise and bluster.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: Trump legitimately lost the elction.
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Mar 30, 2024, 1:34 PM
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He incited them and that's what hundreds of them that were there agree upon. He knew what he was doing. If he didn't realize it, he is an idiot. I saw it coming a mile away. The people that ttacked claimed they were doing it on Trump's orders. That's how they took it.
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CU Medallion [58489]
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He believed his words would rile up the crowd? Absolutely.
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Mar 30, 2024, 2:39 PM
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I believe that you are mistaken if you think that proves he is guilty of what some of those people ultimately did. And yes, some of the people in that crowd were crazy, and them thinking Trump was ordering to break into the capitol does not mean that was what Trump intended. I think your intense hatred for Trump is clouding your thinking, as it does for many.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: He believed his words would rile up the crowd? Absolutely.
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Mar 30, 2024, 2:53 PM
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I am not saying he should be charged with anything, but he did incite them. I think one would have to be an absolute imbecile to thing he didn't incite them over time and then finally that day. The people that were there have said the same. That said, I don't have a hatred for Trump. I just think he is the most unfit for office out of anyone in my lifetime or anyone that any of us will see in our remaining years. I am all for him having a great life outside of being president or running for office. I like I seeing people do well. More power to him.
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All-TigerNet [13182]
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What have you been incited to do?***
Mar 30, 2024, 4:36 PM
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: What have you been incited to do?***
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Mar 30, 2024, 5:09 PM
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Your comment is gibberish and has no context.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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He was sending the signals via tweet and his language....
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Mar 30, 2024, 2:41 PM
[ in reply to Re: Trump legitimately lost the elction. ] |
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Trump tries to speak in a way that creates plausible deniability. But over time, it was clear what he wanted. His followers certainly knew what he meant.
When he told the Proud Boys to "stand down and stand by," that was a clear sign to them that he might need them later (they were part of the J6 riot on purpose).
And when Trump's Red Hat mob was going to locate and hang Mike Pence, he approved it. His own advisers have admitted it in testimony.
Trump deliberately set that mob upon the Capital with bad intentions, and then looked on approvingly during the most violent phase of the attack.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: He was sending the signals via tweet and his language....
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Mar 30, 2024, 2:55 PM
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He also keeps up on social edia and the media in general and he knows what he is creating and what people are thinking. He plays into it. He instigates it.
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CU Medallion [58489]
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Re: He was sending the signals via tweet and his language....
Mar 30, 2024, 4:11 PM
[ in reply to He was sending the signals via tweet and his language.... ] |
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"Clear what he wanted" - It's not clear at all that he intended for them to violently break into the capitol. Not at all. It's not unreasonable for people to believe that he probably did, but to say it's clear that's what he intended - that's a big NO. Was he trying to rile up the crowd, hoping to have a huge, loud and rowdy crowd expressing their disdain for the election and support for him? Absolutely. But that's a very different thing.
"His followers" - I think by that you mean the small minority of wackos who went there planning to storm the capitol, or any other wackos who joined in.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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There were two organized paramilitary groups plus thousands...
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Mar 30, 2024, 5:15 PM
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He told them to come on 1/6, and he sent them to the capital with language about fighting like Hell. And he mocked Mike Pence during the commission of the violence.
It was very obvious what he wanted them to do. In fact, Trump would've been fine if Mike Pence had been killed. I'm not saying he said himself to "Hang Mike Pence." But he didn't have to.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: There were two organized paramilitary groups plus thousands...
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Mar 30, 2024, 5:18 PM
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From Webster's
Incite
stresses a stirring up and urging on, and may or may not imply initiating.
inciting a riot
Synonyms
abet
brew
ferment
foment
instigate
pick
provoke
raise
stir (up)
whip (up)
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CU Medallion [58489]
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Call it what you will, but there is no evidence that Trump organized or was
Mar 30, 2024, 6:52 PM
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involved in the planning of a violent forced entry of the capitol in order to overturn the elction, or for any other reason, or that any of his comments were intended for that purpose. "It's obvious" or "Only a fool would think otherwise" is not evidence, and you claiming to have connected the dots is not evidence. Like I said, it's partisan political noise and bluster.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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"No evidence"?....you're kidding, right?****
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Mar 30, 2024, 7:01 PM
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CU Medallion [58489]
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No, but you must be.***
Mar 30, 2024, 10:13 PM
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: Call it what you will, but there is no evidence that Trump organized or was
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Mar 30, 2024, 7:04 PM
[ in reply to Call it what you will, but there is no evidence that Trump organized or was ] |
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That's not what inciting means. That's the point. He didn't know exactly what they would so, but they did a good thing for him when it happened. He loved it. He didn't know what to expect, but all worked out well. He got them to react and he incited them. He is very similar to Alex Jones.
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CU Medallion [58489]
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If he knew or should have known that would happen, then yes he is guilty.
Mar 30, 2024, 10:11 PM
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I don't think he did, and unless there's something I'm unaware of, they'll have a hard time proving it in court. To reach the level of criminal incitement, speech must create an immediate, specific roadmap to violence. "Go right now and bust down the doors of the capitol, don't let anybody stand in your way, and stop that vote!" would be incitement. "Get on down there and fight like hell" is not, as "fight" does not necessarily mean physical violence. Of course some idiots had already come to the rally prepared to break into the capitol; they didn't need any incitement from Trump - they were already doing it anyway. I'm sure there were other idiots who, fired up by Trump's words, joined in once the attack started, but they didn't get the roadmap or instruction from Trump; Trump could have said "We can't take this anymore", or "we have to take a stand", or "enough is enough", none of which means "knock down the doors and hurt anybody who gets in your way", and these idiots would have still done the same thing.
I agree 100% that he loved it, and privately gloated for a while before speaking out and telling them to stop. That doesn't in any way demonstrate that he incited what ultimately happened from a legal standpoint.
https://www.talksonlaw.com/briefs/freedom-of-speech-what-constitutes-incitement
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CU Medallion [58489]
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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If by "got it bad", you mean, "You're correct"...then, OK****
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Mar 30, 2024, 7:01 PM
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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CU Medallion [58489]
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TDS***
Mar 30, 2024, 10:15 PM
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: TDS***
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Mar 31, 2024, 9:02 AM
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He is good. TDS is actually the derangement syndrome that people possess that still support Trump and still fall for his nonsense at this stage. The MAGA crowd.
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Hall of Famer [24834]
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That majority of people polled at this point...***
Apr 1, 2024, 5:47 PM
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CU Guru [1388]
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Re: Trump legitimately lost the elction.
Apr 1, 2024, 1:18 PM
[ in reply to Trump legitimately lost the elction. ] |
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I voted for him and will vote for him this year. I still have my doubts about that election. I do think Trump should’ve kept his mouth shut or at least been less aggressive. My main issue is with the mail in ballots. I’m 2016 26% of democrats and 21% of republicans voted by mail. In 2020 60% of democrats voted by mail compared to just 32% of republicans. That is a massive gap. Mail in voting and drop boxes are more susceptible to fraud. Call me a conspiracy theorist but I personally don’t trust mail in voting. I also don’t see how you have a 5% difference between parties and mail in voting in 2016 compared to a 28% difference just 4 years later. I understand Covid had started 8 months earlier, still, 60% mail in votes for one party is way more than I would have imagined. Then, of course, people got to bed in the middle of the night on election night with Trump comfortably in the lead and wake up with Biden crushing it a few hours later. So, naturally people were skeptical. Do ballot counters work through the night? Why did all of these Biden votes pop up in the middle of the night? Why was there such a disparity between Trump ballots and Biden ballots when everyone was asleep? Did they just wait until 2 am to count the democrat votes?
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All-TigerNet [10933]
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How pathetic.***
Mar 30, 2024, 6:40 PM
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All-In [34119]
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Why does the truth hurt you so much?***
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Mar 30, 2024, 6:50 PM
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All-TigerNet [10933]
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This is all false propaganda***
Mar 31, 2024, 10:38 AM
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110%er [5703]
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the echo chamber sez
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Mar 30, 2024, 8:36 PM
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he's a fascist. LOL.
He was already ufcking POTUS for four years. What in your lame opinion did he do as a fascist?
You people are too ignorant to vote.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: the echo chamber sez
Mar 30, 2024, 8:40 PM
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You people??
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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Typical hard right-winger view about voting....
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Mar 30, 2024, 8:51 PM
[ in reply to the echo chamber sez ] |
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You label others as unworthy of voting. It just shows your hatred of Democracy.
Trump tried to overturn an election, via a coup, based on the big lie. That's fascism.
His appeal is mostly from complaining about the other, be they immigrants, mexicans, muslims, people from "shit-hole" countries. That's demagoguery, another fascist tool.
He labeled the press the enemy of the people, another fascist tactic.
He's a fascist.
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Legend [19983]
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Re: Typical hard right-winger view about voting....
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Mar 30, 2024, 11:45 PM
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He's a fascist, she's a fascist, them's a fascist, they's a fascist....
...wouldn't you like to be a fascist too?
Be a fascist, vote like a fascist!!!
Doctor Fascist - quench that TDS thirst!
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Hall of Famer [24217]
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Re: Typical hard right-winger view about voting....
Mar 31, 2024, 1:45 AM
[ in reply to Typical hard right-winger view about voting.... ] |
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Democrats tried to take the leading candidate of the opposition party off the ballot. Thankfully, in a liberal decision, the Supreme Court unanimously put an end to voter suppression.
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All-TigerNet [10134]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
Mar 31, 2024, 9:25 AM
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What about the conspiracy of Russian collusion then hired celebrities inciting violence in the other direction when holding fake severed heads on stage? Quit acting like one side is righteous and the other is not. To be fair. I believe all sides have enough corruption to constitute a total house cleaning.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Mar 31, 2024, 10:45 AM
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Not even similar situations. Nice try, but a huge fail.
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All-In [31546]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Apr 1, 2024, 9:11 AM
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None of that matters to his cult, they’re motivated only by their hate of anyone they deem to be in the out group that particular day. There is no agenda, there is no policy, no plan for governance, just hate, vengeance, and chaos.
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Hall of Famer [24217]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Apr 1, 2024, 11:31 AM
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Yep - when Pubs start acting like Dems. Here we are.
As extremely misplaced as it was, maybe the rioters on J6 thought rioting is the way you get the government's attention, after what people witnessed during the Summer of 2020.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy...
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Apr 1, 2024, 11:38 AM
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Jan 6th didn't get them the attention they wanted. It crushed their causes, whatever they were, and made them look like delusional nutcases.
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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Keep an eye on a thing called Project 2025....
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Apr 1, 2024, 12:54 PM
[ in reply to Re: J6 was just the end of a long conspiracy... ] |
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This is a Heritage Foundation document that's essentially a blueprint for what they'd like the next "conservative" President to do. The idea is that Trump would immediately take over the entire Executive Branch on Day One of his administration, and begin firing people and replacing them with his cronies. This would extend far into the ranks of all of the agencies, not just the political appointees.
The idea is to destroy the Administration State that they consider hopelessly "woke", and replace it with their own version of what America should be. The Department of Justice would probably be first and foremost in Trump's mind of what to "deconstruct".
There's alot more in the document about how to attack abortion, how to attack schools, how to set up a foreign policy, how to attack "woke" in general.
The over-riding theme is that the internal enemy is the liberal left. They see these other Americans as global elites who hate America. And this is their attempt to roll back over 100 years of progress that they themselves hate.
https://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/project2025/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf
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Orange Blooded [2583]
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Re: Keep an eye on a thing called Project 2025....
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Apr 1, 2024, 12:57 PM
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That is a given without reading the document.
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Hall of Famer [24217]
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Re: Keep an eye on a thing called Project 2025....
Apr 1, 2024, 1:38 PM
[ in reply to Keep an eye on a thing called Project 2025.... ] |
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All Presidents 'take over' the Executive branch on day one, as the President is the head of the Executive branch.
Message was edited by: p6fuller®
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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Re:Agreed....
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Apr 1, 2024, 3:45 PM
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except all Presidents don't completely gut the agencies & departments within the executive branch. That's what Heritage wants him to do. This is very different and more radical than anything we've seen previously.
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Hall of Famer [24834]
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All-In [31546]
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Show me a Biden boat parade or caravan
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Apr 1, 2024, 6:20 PM
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Or like anyone at all wearing a Biden hat. Let’s not pretend like these are the same.
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Orange Blooded [2583]
TigerPulse: 95%
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Re: Show me a Biden boat parade or caravan
Apr 1, 2024, 6:35 PM
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Solos is in the cult. He is a lost cause now.
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