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YOUR BALANCE
Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?
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Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 2:57 PM

Play it five times if you need to. What kind of coaching leads even to the POSSIBILITY of this happening?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXx0ZzLyX2s

(Props to Memphis Tiger for locating the play)

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

3

Nov 1, 2023, 3:00 PM

Looks like the OL expected Mafah to be blocking, for some reason

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

2

Nov 1, 2023, 3:03 PM

How was it Mafah's fault if he was in motion to the opposite side before the snap?

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:07 PM

Where did I say it was Mafah's fault?

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:09 PM

point taken...let me rephrase that...how could the OL have thought it was Mafah's fault if he was in motion to the opposite side?

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:10 PM

I don't know, that's why I said "for some reason". Misunderstood the play call? Didn't know their assignment? I have no idea, but I also have no other explanation for the tackle completely ignoring the blitzing DE.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

2

Nov 1, 2023, 3:09 PM [ in reply to Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!? ]

Right?!?!? I mean do yall even know football at this point? Mafah had an out route to the flat on the right side of the line. The blitz that got home was the DE from the left tackle spot. On the left side of the line you had 3 hats on 3 hats. The right side you had two lineman and a backer showing blitz which he backed off leaving Mafah free to continue his route (which it doesn't look like he was supposed to be blocking anyway as the check down).

This was on the left tackle protecting the blind side of Cade. You can probably also blame left guard and center for the wrong shift but obviously their guys didn't get free.

Yall just dumb.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

2

Nov 1, 2023, 3:12 PM

You and I are saying the same thing. At no point did I blame Mafah. I'm trying to explain WHY the OL didn't block the right defenders, and the only plausible reason I came up with is that they had an expectation (a very wrong one) that Mafah was blocking there.

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Exactly . . .

2

Nov 1, 2023, 3:17 PM [ in reply to Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!? ]

I notice that the center moved so far back that the LG ended up having to engage the defender who had lined up over center, which meant that the LT ended up blocking the defender who'd been lined up over the LG, leaving the DE free. Everybody's matchup got shifted right. In a way, the LG taking the nose guard left the LT stranded with two guys to block. But still, you'd expect he would have attempted to manage that DE since him getting around the edge is a bigger risk than the other guy slipping through a hole. Besides, the LT seemed to affirmatively engage the guy he took - he didn't just "wait" and block the space . . . he took a defender. Not sure why.

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Re: Exactly . . .


Nov 1, 2023, 6:42 PM

It’s not a blitz. It is the DE so always the LTs responsibility. Even if you are blocking down, you at least throw an arm out to slow him down/change the angle. It isn’t coaching in this case but TERRIBLE execution. More evidence of “it’s a combination of a LOT of little things”.

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I agree.


Nov 1, 2023, 6:55 PM [ in reply to Exactly . . . ]

If you freeze the play about a second after the snap, you don't see the OL trying to form a pocket. The right side dropped into pass protection, while the left side attacked the defender. The OL forms almost a straight line running diagonal to the LOS. (Left tackle is at the LOS, right tackle is 3 yards off the LOS.)

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:01 PM

The NC State defender who came free was probably Mafah's responsibility. Mafah blew it, probably because the coaching staff hasn't taught him what to do there.

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There are many flaws in our coaching that need to be fixed

1
1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:04 PM

But if you actually think Mafah has not been taught to block correctly that is all I need to know about your intellect going forward.

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Re: There are many flaws in our coaching that need to be fixed

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:06 PM

Mafah goes in motion away from the blitzing defender, no OL touch players for the defense and clowns blame Mafah.

How ridiculous.

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Outhouse coaches. They expext an educated response of Tigernet??***


Nov 1, 2023, 3:07 PM



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Re: There are many flaws in our coaching that need to be fixed


Nov 1, 2023, 3:23 PM [ in reply to Re: There are many flaws in our coaching that need to be fixed ]

We lost the FSU game because of the strip sack for a touchdown when Mafah missed a blocking assignment...

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Re: There are many flaws in our coaching that need to be fixed


Nov 1, 2023, 3:46 PM [ in reply to Re: There are many flaws in our coaching that need to be fixed ]

There's no way for someone other than Clemson coaches and players to know who had responsibility for the blitzing defender. I think it was probably Mafah. Maybe it was somebody else. Maybe it was nobody. Anybody who says they know for sure is an idiot.

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So you dont know for sure whether it was Mafah but


Nov 1, 2023, 5:22 PM

If it was Mafah then it was the coaches fault. Got it! You’re an idiot.

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Re: So you dont know for sure whether it was Mafah but


Nov 1, 2023, 7:27 PM

Based on what others have posted, I now think Klubnik called an audible that left the free defender unaccounted for.

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Re: So you dont know for sure whether it was Mafah but


Nov 1, 2023, 7:31 PM

You’ve covered most of the bases. Will your next guess be that it was Godwin’s fault?

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:08 PM

Looked like a Tyler Moment to me....

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 3:11 PM

Just my non-coach guess, but the OL should have picked up a hat for a hat starting with the blind side end, and Mafah would have blocked the nearest lineman if need be since he was in motion to that side anyway.

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If I remember correctly, Cade stepped up to the line and made an audible on this

2

Nov 1, 2023, 3:15 PM

play. The way it broke down, it sure looks like a slide protection was called in that each offensive lineman shifted to the right. Either Cade audibled into it and missed the outside blitzer that became his responsibility to deal with, or he tried to call the O-Line out of that protection and they busted. Because why else does Mafah motion and go immediately to the right. If Mafah is in a protect/release scheme on that play, then he should be releasing either up the middle or to the side he started on. Leads me to believe that Mafah had no blocking responsibility on this play. Either way, the QB and O-Line were not on the same page.

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Looked like OL shifted right, in which case it's on Cade to see that the DE


Nov 1, 2023, 3:24 PM

is a free rusher and he has to get rid of it quick.

These are the non tangibles that Deshaun and Trevor were good at and where we've been lacking since.

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it's a Blake Miller classic***


Nov 1, 2023, 3:16 PM



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Re: it's a Blake Miller classic***

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:20 PM

So is he really middle school terrible? Or is it something else more nefarious? I'd really like to see Dabo's breakdown of this on a video board for the fans.

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they probably practiced it all week but then something came in last minute on th


Nov 1, 2023, 3:23 PM

play call

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Clemson OL does this over and over and over again


Nov 1, 2023, 3:30 PM [ in reply to Re: it's a Blake Miller classic*** ]

even on critical plays

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Re: Clemson OL does this over and over and over again


Nov 1, 2023, 3:49 PM

So this pattern on critical plays is purposeful. It's not just a "missed play".

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It was Colin Sadler, not Blake Miller.***


Nov 1, 2023, 4:13 PM [ in reply to Re: it's a Blake Miller classic*** ]



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Go rewatch the phenomenal block in the same part of the field on the last play


Nov 1, 2023, 3:17 PM

vs Miami in 2OT

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teams are going to do this a bunch moving forward


Nov 1, 2023, 3:19 PM

you place 2 defenders in front of a Clemson OL men
the OL will block 0 of them. 1 DL will pursue the backfield. The other will not move.

gets the Clemson Tiger OL every single time

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:22 PM
559557.jpeg(75.6 K)



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Whoever called the OL to slide protect right shift is the cause of the sack


Nov 1, 2023, 3:25 PM

If the OL had stayed in the original positions, the DE would not have had a free run at the QB.

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Yeah that's what it looks like but I can't understand


Nov 1, 2023, 3:32 PM

why they ever do that with an extra rusher out wide.

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I'm not gonna pretend to know anything about OL blocking schemes


Nov 1, 2023, 3:30 PM

but I can't imagine why the LT doesn't pick up the outside rusher there. With Mafah going out in the flat the opposite direction there's never going to be anyone else to pick that guy up.

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Re: I'm not gonna pretend to know anything about OL blocking schemes


Nov 1, 2023, 3:47 PM

Because the slide right was called and it left our center with nobody to block and caused the LT to leave the edge unprotected.

We had it covered until the left side slid right.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 3:32 PM

If I'm not mistaken, that looks a lot like the FSU pick-6. Cade completely blindsided (because he wasn't looking in that direction). Seems it should be someone's responsibility to see that before it happens and pick them up. Not playing the blame game here. But I recall ETN becoming a much more valuable player in the backfield when he learned to block. Maybe some of you pay closer attention that I, but I don't see Shipley or Mafah doing a lot of that. But here again, not Mafah's fault on that one if he's in motion the other way. Maybe Cade sees it and tells Mafah not to go in motion but to pick that guy up. But they're not supposed to do that. They have to stay within the system. Run the play as called. Maybe that's the kind of coaching you're referring to.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:40 PM

The FSU play was 5x more understandable (but still not excusable) because the guy that rushed in came in far off the line and was kind of out of sight when the play started. THIS play, the guy is literally lined up ON THE LINE and could give our Left Tackle at wet willy if he wanted to before the play even is snapped.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 3:40 PM

This is another in the long line of "you only know the result". A bad result it was but at least we got the ball back.

What you want to know is what was the blocking scheme and what were the assignments. You would have to be a coach or player to know that.

You don't know, I don't know but the coaches and players know what happened and who did not execute.

Would be nice to know, but then everyone would know and that kinda defeats the purpose...

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?

1

Nov 1, 2023, 3:47 PM

Left Tackle did not know the play, had no idea #7 motioned into the backfield and that he had to pick up the edage rusher.. That is not a coaching issue, that is player not knowing their assignment.


Message was edited by: Tigerbalm1®


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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 3:54 PM

A player not knowing his assignment is usually a coaching issue. If he doesn't know his assignment, he either didn't hear the call, went rogue - or the coach didn't have a qualified player to put in who knew what he was doing.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 3:56 PM

And as NIKE points out, Blake Miller has been doing this exact thing all season.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:05 PM

I haven't been a fan of Miller since his first game - he was lost then and he's still lost quite often. He gets beat like a drum on stunts and twists.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:17 PM

At what point does lost become intentional?

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:22 PM

Blake Miller is intentionally playing poorly?

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:29 PM

No, I'd say that the problem with Miller is that we don't have anyone better.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:30 PM [ in reply to Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!? ]

Is that even a possibility? I have no idea? I know it's possible to be lazy. I know it's also possible to unmotivated. I just don't know at what point do any of those things add up to be on purpose?

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I'm going to say it louder for the people in the back

1

Nov 1, 2023, 7:43 PM [ in reply to Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!? ]

Blake Miller is our RIGHT Tackle. The example being discussed here shows the pressure coming from the LEFT side.

Not saying Blake Miller hasn't played poorly this year, but he doesn't deserve the blame in this instance when he was on the complete opposite side of the ball.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:07 PM [ in reply to Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!? ]

Right, somewhere along the line the staff failed ot mention that the Left Tackles Repsonsiblity is the the DE.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 4:27 PM

If you look at the LB (or safety) right over the center, but just slightly off the line, I think he may have confused our OL by appearing to be a NG, which could cause the OL to believe that the guy our OT blocked WAS the DE and the actual DE was a safety (or CB), which could lead them to think that he would be picked up by Mafah.

It seems to be a case of somebody trying to do too much..... a habit that Dabo mentions about Cade.

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IDK but most Tnetters have blamed CK2 for the fumble***


Nov 1, 2023, 3:59 PM



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Re: IDK but most Tnetters have blamed CK2 for the fumble***


Nov 1, 2023, 4:19 PM

It wasn't Cade's fault, unless he's the one that called for the slide protect.

I haven't figured out who calls blocking assignments for our OL. I see the center pointing out various defensive threats, but I don't know if he's calling the blocking assignment or relaying threats to the QB who thens calls the blocking assignments.

When I played football (100 years ago) on a single wing team, I was the strong side TE. My jobs were to block, catch and call blocking assignments. It wasn't terribly hard to call the blocking assignment, because I only had to worry about whether the edge was sealed or if the edge rusher needed to be kicked out..... which meant the only people involved in any blocking changes were me and the wingback - so I had to decide if we needed to switch blocking assignments to provide the hope at the point of attack - which usually was only needed on an off-tackle run.

When I played on a full-T team, nobody called any blocking assignments - we just ran the play as designed because there were no fancy defenses and we used 2 TEs, so blitzes weren't terribly effective.

Now, with spread offenses and nickel/dime looks, it's necessary for someone to call the blocking assignments. It can most likely be the QB or center, but someone who understands what's happening in the matchups is needed to avoid what happened on this play.

My guess is our QB makes the call - and that's part of Cade's need for learning.

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All I know is that the QB needs to gain some awareness.....

1

Nov 1, 2023, 4:46 PM

The fumbles are a big problem.
This is the type of play that needs to either become a harmless incomplete pass or a punishing of an aggressive defense....not a double digit loss in crunch time.

But waiting until the 4th quarter to really do anything against a sub-par N.C. State team is not going to lead us to success.

Hoping that Notre Dame is asleep at the wheel a bit this weekend with the noon kickoff and our struggles....and that somehow we make a play early that gets us into the game.

I generally have thought we were going to win before each game, basically since since 2015.
This Saturday is really the first time since then that I'm going in and not predicting a win.
Notre Dame has played well recently. After us, due to an early game, they have a BYE and then close with Wake and Stanford, who they will beat handily. I'm pretty sure they are eager to get to 10-2 and climb the rankings as other teams in front of them lose over the next few weeks.

All that said, we have the opportunity to pull a nice upset Saturday....
Last year's Notre Dame game really kickstarted a tailspin of sorts, maybe this year it can be the opposite.

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I saw it live and on the replay.

1

Nov 1, 2023, 5:44 PM

Thanks for posting it here. Watched it a few more times. Stopped the tape during the play.

Here is my observation and question:

Six defenders on the line. 5 OL to block them. Mafah goes in motion well before the snap.

I conclude that if all 6 come Cade is supposed to dump it off quickly to Mafah. When only 5 come, you've got a hat on a hat and Cade should have at least a litte time to throw the ball.

But, whatever happened, here is my simple question -

How did the left tackle (Miller?) think that it was not his responsibility to block the DE?

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Re: I saw it live and on the replay.


Nov 1, 2023, 5:47 PM

Because somebody called a slide right for the OL.

This is the sort of stuff I hate about zone blocking.

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You may be right, but...


Nov 1, 2023, 6:51 PM

....I find it hard to believe that "slide right" would be the call with Mafah going in motion. The DE was not blitzing. He was lined up in the traditional DE spot. With a slide right blocking scheme someone has to assume the DE is going to drop into coverage. I find that extremely difficult to believe.

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 6:22 PM

And on the play right before the free release of the DE from our LT, our RT free releases a late LB blitz. If Cade had to hold the ball for a half second more....sigh

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Columbia Tiger has it right....The LT and LG were slide protecting the gap where


Nov 1, 2023, 7:16 PM

LT is protecting the B gap. But the weird thing is the right side is setting up in man on man pass Pro.

It's a weird play...Unsure if the LT and LG didn't hear the right protection, but if you look at their first steps, they were hard to the right...They did what they had been taught to do, so here it's not on the OL, unless they didn't hear the protection and just guessed.

Feels like they blocked it as it had been drawn up, but either Cade is supposed to see the DE and dump off quick if needed OR it's just a screwed up play to begin with....

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Re: Someone on God's Green Earth tell me what happens at the 18:12 mark!?


Nov 1, 2023, 7:47 PM

Gotta be on Mafah. He needs to protect the back side before he goes on a route. If it’s not him then the entire OL screwed up that play.

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