Replies: 66
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CU Guru [1083]
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Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:32 PM
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Thoughts?
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110%er [7219]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:34 PM
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This is going to ruin college football.
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CU Guru [1083]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:38 PM
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Agreed, I’m kind of worried about the future of the game.
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110%er [6882]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:55 PM
[ in reply to Re: Breaking news ] |
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Yeppers, and will only affect a small number of players on a team, the ones that are probably already going to be able to go pro. So will there be jealousy among teammates. All playing hard and a few profiting beyond free education.
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Orange Blooded [4114]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:00 PM
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The reason that the NCAA is against this isn't because the top players will get paid for their likeness.
It's because Auburn and USC will guarantee the right guard they are recruiting $50k in card and jersey signings.
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Orange Blooded [4903]
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^^ exactly
Sep 13, 2019, 3:46 PM
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Nm
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110%er [7542]
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Chump change to what certain Oregon, Stanford
Sep 13, 2019, 7:04 PM
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(Any Texas school) billionaire will do. This won’t come close to passing in SC- probably won’t make it out of committee. Very well may pass in CA and then lots of litigation. They are determined to kill the goose. It will ruin college athletics not just football. It would be like pro football without a salary cap. Interest in going to the games is down. People are going to totally check out if there is a non-competitive product. These guys can do something else if they don’t want to go to college. Seriously go to Canada or Europe if the NFL won’t take you yet- somebody will or will start one to do so. Football basically supports all other sports minus men’s basketball. No $- no scholarships- guess which group that’s going to impact the most- the impoverished/under priv that don’t have as much of an opp for college.
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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So you're saying it will be like the real world
Sep 13, 2019, 2:03 PM
[ in reply to Re: Breaking news ] |
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where those who excel in their jobs make more money than those who are just average.
Last year many believed that if Trevor Lawrence could go pro he would've been the first player taken. But he couldn't go pro, he is literally not allowed to make money while working in his chosen profession. Furthermore, Clemson, the ACC and the networks are all making money off of Trevor's image and likeness. Sorry, that's just not right.
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110%er [7219]
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Re: So you're saying it will be like the real world
Sep 13, 2019, 2:05 PM
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No, I’m saying it will destroy competitive balance. Without that the sport is a farce.
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting
Sep 13, 2019, 2:10 PM
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there is competitive balance now? We have a system where the same teams make the playoffs every year. Fortunately Clemson is one of those teams, but there is no competitive balance. Beyond Clemson, Bama, Ohio State and Oklahoma there aren't many teams that have a chance to make the playoffs.
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All-In [38452]
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Re: I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting
Sep 13, 2019, 2:22 PM
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You leave out Georgia on purpose ?
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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Yes, because the one time they made the playoffs it was
Sep 13, 2019, 2:24 PM
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a fluke, just like Michigan State and Washington
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All-In [38452]
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Re: Yes, because the one time they made the playoffs it was
Sep 13, 2019, 2:30 PM
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That's a solid take on it as a whole .
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting
Sep 13, 2019, 2:39 PM
[ in reply to Re: I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting ] |
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I'll just be glad when ND whips that UGA butt in a couple of weeks, and we can put UGA in the YSIO category that Uncle Lou has.
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All-In [29046]
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I understand his argument
Sep 13, 2019, 2:29 PM
[ in reply to I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting ] |
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The measure of competitive balance we have now is due to a "level playing field" of available scholarships and equal "pay" (schooling, books, stipends, etc).
Adding in a financial component as being reimbursed for use of the student athlete's likeness will erode that existing competitive balance.
With that said, I've said all along that this will fundamentally change the landscape of college athletics, but that it is still the right thing to do. A well structured set of balancing rules have to be in place to try and keep as much competitive balance as possible, but in the end a person deserves the right to profit from their own likeness, so it is simply the right thing to do.
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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You have presented both sides well, thank you
Sep 13, 2019, 2:49 PM
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I just disagree that there is a level playing field at all. First, the system is inherently rigged against non P5 schools. Then, among the P5 schools there is a huge imbalance between the schools with money and the schools without it. Would Dabo be able to recruit as successfully at Clemson without the facilities we have? What if his recruiting budget was 1/3 of what it is now? Would he still have the top 2020 class? How many schools can afford to pay a football coach what Dabo earns at Clemson?
If you allow athletes to profit on their own likeness, there will still likely be limits on scholarships and pay (schooling, books, stipends, etc). But the more successful athletes can make money, and as you said it is simply the right thing to do.
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All-In [29046]
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Oh, I get that
Sep 13, 2019, 3:15 PM
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I just think that this is the last barrier that allows teams that are not as financially set to compete and allows upward mobility of programs based on investment of time and effort (and not solely financially).
When you open up payment of players (which is what this inevitably will lead to, and again, in principal I'm OK with it), then it becomes the teams with the bigger fanbases can pay more (unless rules are in place as to how much each school can pay, much like scholarship allowances).
All that has to be worked out, but in the end 18-22 year olds who go out there and make big money for the programs deserved a cut of the pie for their efforts. That principal just seems right to me, and so it needs to be (and eventually will be) worked out.
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110%er [6882]
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Re: I understand his argument
Sep 13, 2019, 3:07 PM
[ in reply to I understand his argument ] |
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So someone like Trevor or DJ Uiagalelei would be paid in high school. As they are/were that famous. So what else can players be paid for and how will that impact their signing with a college. Christian Wilkins could have gotten a contract for baking cakes, you can't allow payment for one skill and not another. He could have been the face of Hostess Cupcakes!
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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I don't even understand the questions you're asking
Sep 13, 2019, 3:16 PM
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We're talking about college, not high school. Also, Christian Wilkins can bake cakes if he wants, just like he was a substitute teacher while at Clemson.
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All-American [586]
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Re: I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting
Sep 13, 2019, 6:46 PM
[ in reply to I wasn't responding to you, but are you suggesting ] |
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That Clemson is 1 of 4 teams strongly suggests that competitive balance exists & serving it's purpose. Quotas are a solution, if you want to see different names in the playoff each year; but difficult to maintain the appearance of being merit based-
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All-TigerNet [11089]
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start a farm league and let
Sep 13, 2019, 2:42 PM
[ in reply to So you're saying it will be like the real world ] |
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players like TL skip college. Then college sports will normalize back to that talent level. If you start paying college players (on top of the $175K they get now in tuition, etc) the whole college system will go to $hit real quick!
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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They've tried, there's no market for a farm league
Sep 13, 2019, 2:53 PM
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There's a huge market for college football though, where the kids can't make money.
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110%er [7219]
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Re: They've tried, there's no market for a farm league
Sep 13, 2019, 5:01 PM
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So is it the colleges or the players that are really adding value here? Your argument seems to fail here.
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Orange Blooded [4947]
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Re: So you're saying it will be like the real world
Sep 13, 2019, 3:21 PM
[ in reply to So you're saying it will be like the real world ] |
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Your argument is with the NFL not the NCAA. The NFL says players cannot go pro. The NCAA says you cannot profit as an armature. Without the NFL rule this wouldn’t be a problem. This is the reason I hope the XFL succeeds and takes the players who value money over an educAtion with them. I could have made money out of high school but my future is better because I decided to get my degree from Clemson University.
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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No, my argument is with the NCAA, not the NFL
Sep 13, 2019, 3:35 PM
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I don't care about the 3-year rule, I think it's fine. But I have a problem with football players not being able to make money from the use of their likeness.
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Hall of Famer [22127]
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Re: So you're saying it will be like the real world
Sep 13, 2019, 3:34 PM
[ in reply to So you're saying it will be like the real world ] |
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It appears to me there is at least one simple solution. If a prospect believes he/she is good enough to go to the pros out of high school, change the rule so they can do so. The others can opt for the old college route. We often hear some say he/she is ready for the pros but I would venture to say only a limited few would make the team come the first regular season game.
Most of us went to college to develop marketable skills and we had to pay for it. If an athlete opts for the college route, he/she is given a free ride and other benefits to develop his/her marketable skills in a sport plus marketable skills in another area per their degree. I would imagine few if any full scholarship athletes leave school with a huge student loan in their face as many regular students do.
I can see the opportunity for illegal recruiting such as we have never seen before should this plan be adopted. The recent and ongoing basketball scandals are a prime example of what, to me, we would see in the future. The ineptness of the NCAA in ferreting out these scandals is on public display. Had not the Federal government become involved in the investigation, these illegal activities may have never come to light.
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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All good points Joe, and I think we all understand it is
Sep 13, 2019, 3:55 PM
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a very difficult topic and any solutions need to be well thought out.
Yes we went to college to develop marketable skills. People who went to school go to into marketing can get a paid job with a marketing firm while still in school. Architecture students can get a paid job at an architecture firm. When I was at Clemson I had a paid job at a law firm, same as when I was in law school.
Trevor Lawrence wants to go to the NFL, he can't get a paid job playing football while in college. He could skip college and play in other professional leagues and then go to the NFL, but I'm not sure that would be as beneficial as college football.
Meanwhile the school is making how many millions on the football team from increased revenues? How much does Dabo make? The ACC? Swofford? ESPN? And each of these unpaid athletes is one injury away from never playing football again. Sure they have insurance policies, but how do those policies compare to a career in the NFL?
But hey, if you want to buy a #9 or #16 jersey, they're available for purchase at clemsontigers.com
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Orange Blooded [2551]
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Spot on Joe!
Sep 13, 2019, 4:43 PM
[ in reply to Re: So you're saying it will be like the real world ] |
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These student athletes are already getting paid plenty. Like you said, not only tuition, but free coaching, meals, housing, tutoring, and many other fringe benefits. Look at all the swag they get during their college careers.
What most don’t realize is the development they are getting for free to improve their future endeavors, whether it is on the field or in an office. The rest of the students have to PAY their way through. Tired of all the whining about not getting paid. They are getting paid. Oh, no one is forcing them to play football at a college. They have options.
Go Tigers!
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Scout Team [198]
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Re: So you're saying it will be like the real world
Sep 13, 2019, 7:06 PM
[ in reply to So you're saying it will be like the real world ] |
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Trevor is being compensated handsomely. He gets a free education plus access to college football's distribution facility to build his brand. He wasn't the number one pick before last year.
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Heisman Winner [141036]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:37 PM
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"Similar proposals in recent years, including from Kimpson and Bamberg, have failed to gain traction at the S.C. State House. A 2015 bill filed by then-state Rep. Joshua Putnam, R-Anderson, that closely mirrors the California legislation, never even got a hearing."
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CU Guru [1083]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:38 PM
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So what you’re saying is we should be safe from anything like this passing?
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Heisman Winner [141036]
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Has picked up no momentum in the past.***
Sep 13, 2019, 1:41 PM
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Oculus Spirit [97944]
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It may well get momentum this time, or next time
Sep 13, 2019, 2:12 PM
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If California enacts this law, SC, everyone will lose top players to California. EVERY 5-star guy is going to want to go to Cali and play for an endorsement deal.
Otherwise, only hope is having the NCAA drop all the Cali schools. Not sure even that would stop the exodus of 5-star talent to California.
So yeah, if the NCAA doesn't stop this, it will become the law of the land. Depending on how far things progress (and they will progress to payments, etc.), then I see myself being an old man watching high school football and Clemson having no sports teams.
I predict maybe something like what happens now in baseball. There will be an NFL minor league that will form to take the very best talent (and endorsements) and leave the colleges with the rest.
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Team Captain [473]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:41 PM
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It’s a long time coming.
If they are going to treat these athletes that are bringing in millions for the university like regular students they should treat the coaches like regular teachers which includes their salary.
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Heisman Winner [141036]
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I was wondering what Jhop thought about this issue.***
Sep 13, 2019, 1:42 PM
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All-In [30934]
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I gotta agree..
Sep 13, 2019, 1:57 PM
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The coaches and administrators are the ones making the money.
I have a similar unpopular opinion about the players. Get rid of the lower admission standards for athletes. Have tryouts from the student population.
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Legend [16748]
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CU Medallion [66101]
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The State bozos are just thinking that they will get a huge
Sep 13, 2019, 1:41 PM
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influx of funds from taxes on those earnings. They can't even decide how to handle money they already don't have, they should keep their nose out of college athletics.
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CU Guru [1167]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:42 PM
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Should be insignificant news since this went nowhere earlier and will not get any traction this time.
AC is predominately liberals and not the case in SC.
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Team Captain [473]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:43 PM
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Hopefully we’ll get a new NCAA Game out of this.
I’m sick of sitting here playing 2014 all day.
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Heisman Winner [141036]
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I was wondering what Jhop did all day.***
Sep 13, 2019, 1:44 PM
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Oculus Spirit [82147]
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Re: I was wondering what Jhop did all day.***
Sep 13, 2019, 3:35 PM
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CU Guru [1083]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 1:51 PM
[ in reply to Re: Breaking news ] |
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I’ll agree with that for sure!
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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Good, I hope it passes***
Sep 13, 2019, 1:46 PM
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All-Pro [660]
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How much would have T Boone Pickens
Sep 13, 2019, 1:49 PM
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Paid Trevor as an Okie Staye QB to appear in his car commercials??
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Heisman Winner [105574]
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I give up, how much?***
Sep 13, 2019, 1:51 PM
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CU Medallion [68314]
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Re: Breaking news-imagine you're a coot and you can make $
Sep 13, 2019, 1:47 PM
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off you name and likeness except no one give a rats patoot about you. That's the coot reality
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Letterman [275]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:12 PM
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It will have to pass the House then the Senate first - if you object to it, let your objections be heard by contacting your elected state representatives.
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110%er [5977]
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I don’t see the big deal, only a small % of NFL
Sep 13, 2019, 2:18 PM
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Players make money off their image, so college will be even less. This perception that wealthy fans will spend millions on high school players to come to their school is just silly, wealthy people don’t waste their money.
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All-In [30934]
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. I'm certain wealthy people in
Sep 13, 2019, 2:33 PM
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Mississippi wil pay gobs of money to make ole miss relevant.
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110%er [5306]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:21 PM
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Alright I'll play devils advocate. Say all this stuff passes and it leads to all professional sports being allowed to draft straight out of highschool. And say this leads all professional sports to having successful minor leagues to develop said talent to ready them for the pros. And this in turn leads to colleges now playing sports with less physically gifted STUDENT athletes. It wont change who I pull for and as long as all the other schools are playing from the same pool of the same type of players, I won't care. I'll still scream and yell for my beloved Tigers!
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All-In [29046]
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It likely becomes much like college baseball
Sep 13, 2019, 2:38 PM
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And I'm with you, as long as the level of teams all adjust fairly equally, I'm still interested and watching.
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CU Guru [1676]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:37 PM
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I haven't seen anyone come up with a comprehensive plan, if we're to pay players, where it would not open a can of worms. If states do this, the NCAA can ban those players ,schools etc. I'm not totally against it, if there was strict guidelines that would be regulated and monitored extensively. But we are talking about the NCAA. So as of now I'm against it, I do believe this will be the beginning of the end unless it's really regulated.
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All-American [574]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:38 PM
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This is the last desperate hope for The Roosters. In their twisted way of thinking. It will allow them to catch Clemson. No matter how much money they're allowed to pay players. Nothing makes up for good coaching and a winning culture.
Go Tigers!
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110%er [5287]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:45 PM
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Doesn't help that view that the two mentioned in most of these reports, Kimpson and Bramberg, are both South Carolina graduates...
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CU Guru [1857]
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State of S.C. actually out in front of something for once!!
Sep 13, 2019, 2:52 PM
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I think the NCAA still won’t allow it, but if they ever do at least S.C. won’t be playing catch up.
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Orange Blooded [4858]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 2:59 PM
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Sounds like this is how the Coots are gonna try to get rid of Dabo.
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Legend [16342]
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why not?
Sep 13, 2019, 3:43 PM
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people dont buy number 16 clemson jerseys because they like the number...if the school can make bank off of them then the players should get a cut..the whole "they get free college" argument is long stale
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110%er [9694]
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I bought Clemson jerseys for my sons. The numbers available
Sep 13, 2019, 3:47 PM
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happen to be for the current popular player (like #16). But I was going to buy a CLEMSON jersey, no matter whose number it happened to be.
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110%er [8139]
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Re: why not?
Sep 13, 2019, 4:13 PM
[ in reply to why not? ] |
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people dont buy number 16 clemson jerseys because they like the number...if the school can make bank off of them then the players should get a cut..the whole "they get free college" argument is long stale
It’s stale only if a person puts zero value on a full ride education plus all the other perks of playing college football.
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MVP [529]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 3:43 PM
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The rich boosters at the biggest school will line up to buy 40,000 bobbleheads of every hot rod player that agrees to play at their school. Might as well just give them $$$ and have a bidding war.
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110%er [8139]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 4:09 PM
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Proposed by two Dem lawmakers so there is zero chance of passage.
I would love to see the collages say they don’t want to run a professional team and opt out. They already provide a full ride education and COA so to say the athletes are not benefiting from their work is not factually accurate. If they don’t want an education then they should do something else
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All-TigerNet [11016]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 4:11 PM
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itshappeningronpaul.gif
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Orange Blooded [2034]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 4:23 PM
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To clarify a few points... 1. The 3-year rule is an NFL rule, not college. 2. The proposed legislation is to allow student athletes to earn money off their name, image, likeness - it has nothing to do with colleges paying students. 3. This thing will stick this time and force the NCCA’s hand. Big changes coming by 2023. 4. It will be difficult if not impossible to prevent boosters from funneling bid dollars to recruits, 5. The character of college football will dramatically change, and to many, not for the better. 6. Only a small % if students will benefit. Of 85 scholarship players maybe a dozen on a typical team will benefit,
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Varsity [211]
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Re: Breaking news
Sep 13, 2019, 6:54 PM
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Dabo said he might as well coach in the pros if college players are paid.
This will open Pandora’s box to disaster to CFB
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Legend [17899]
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Indifferent***
Sep 13, 2019, 7:20 PM
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CU Medallion [53247]
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I feel pay to play is coming--like it or not
Sep 14, 2019, 6:32 AM
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It would be best if an organization like the NCAA (for example) set strict, uniform, enforceable rules. All of the players would get the same amount of pay monthly (more than just a stipend) depending on their college's division. The money would be deposited directly into each player's account with accounts to be institutionally, independently, and NCAA audited both randomly and on a regularly scheduled basis. No jerseys or likenesses of any kind are to be used for profit by schools, businesses, or anyone else.
Those are just a few thoughts--I'm sure there are better ideas out there. Basically, what I am saying is that it's better to have a plan in place to keep everything fair and under control with checks and balances. Otherwise, it's going to get nasty.
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